Exhaust actuator shaft

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bmiller
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Post by bmiller »

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luckymick wrote:Ok - took the right case off. Struggled with the clutch cable a bit. Finally had to take the lever off (manual implies you can leave the cable seated in the lever...).

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Found my problem (red circle). Bent the LEVER-COMP,GOVERNOR, Part: 13236-1260. I assume when I purchase a new one that the "Pin" on the the Governor Lever will rest on the 'disc' below the white plastic sprocket (blue arrow)?

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It will rest inside the mechanism,.. there is a small slot the pin rides in. You should be able to lift up on the white gear and have the entire mechanism pull out.
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Post by luckymick »

Brian,

A clarifying question: the "slot the pin rides in" would be that gap between the metal discs? That is, between the disc that rides over the bearing (sort of a 1/2 bell shape) and the disc below that white sprocket/spring?
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doctord23
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Post by doctord23 »

You are correct.
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1984 KX500 (original owner)
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Post by luckymick »

doctord23 - thanks for clarifying.

Also - out of general knowledge: how does that system work? Does that shaft with the two discs and white sprocket shift from left to right turning the exhaust shaft moving the KIPS valve open/closed?

Tried to make it work but figured it wouldn't with the right cover off.
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DirtBikeDad
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Re: Exhaust actuator shaft

Post by DirtBikeDad »

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luckymick wrote:Working on my first top end.

Went to put the exhaust actuator back together and, while supporting, my hand slipped and I over torqued the shaft.

Now the shaft is twisted 2 teeth to the left causing the shaft lever to be off.

Any suggestions on how to remedy? Or do I have to take the whole engine apart to fix/reset the actuator shaft?

Image

Redline is where the lever should be...

Any help would be appreciated![/img]
OK folks, I'm in a somewhat similar spot here. My '03 220 started running very rough from just off idle to the first 1/4 turn of the throttle early this summer. I've fully dissasembled and cleaned/dipped the carb twice and all but certain that the problem is not with a clogged jet or some other carb problem.

Have sort of narrowed it down to a possible broken or gummed up KIPS and to be honest I'm a bit intimidated about tackling that beast. For one reason, I have an older manual on hand and the KIPS setup on my bike is nothing like the one in the manual (mine is like the picture above and the manual has the instructions for the one like what is displayed here http://www.geocities.com/a57ngel/moto/kips.html)

Today I removed the pipe and the right side KIPS cover and was a little surprised at what I found (even though I really have no idea what things should look like or how it should work.)

First off, the gears and inside of this cover were spotless, no spooge or dirt at all....but also no oil. Is this how it should be? I was expecting this thing to be completely spooged over.

Secondly, the actuator arm is sitting in exactly the same position as the one in the picture above with just the last 2 teeth just catching on the gear. I expected that I would be able to turn the mechanism left and right by hand and watch the flappers in action but it is stuck in this position and will not turn at all clockwise but does have enough play to move maybe 1/2 a tooth distance counter-clockwise. Is this right or has it, as I fear, maybe jumped timing and broken on the other end of the shaft as I think was mentioned as a possibility earlier in this thread when discussing the picture above?

Next is the flapper(s). Looking into the exhaust flange, the flappers are sitting flush against the roof (Full open or closed?...not sure which way they would move if the gears would actually turn. They don't appear to have a lot of carbon deposits at least on the bottom side that is visible but who knows what the other side looks like.

The piston looks very nice and shows no signs of scratches, gouges or nicks at all. Neither does the cylinder, but instead of a shiny surface with crosshatching I was expecting it has a more dull and mottled appearance. Does this sound right or is it possibly time to replate?

The bike revs out fine and runs great throughout the upper 3/4 of the throttle and exhibits nothing that sounds like piston slap or a worn main bearing that I have witnessed on friends bikes that ar all clapped out. (The piston.....at least the exhaust side... shows no damage at all.)

I'm open for any advice here. First things first I guess is that I need to get my hands on the later model repair manual.[/b]
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Indawoods
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Post by Indawoods »

If it's a 220 with stock piston... replace it with a WISCO.

The first time I tore my bike down... the KIPS arm had never moved since new.... still had a dab of grease on the claw gear.... So, I took everything apart, cleaned well and reassembled it.... It then moved and worked perfectly. I imagine yours is stuck like mine was. Never did figure out why....
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Post by DirtBikeDad »

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Indawoods wrote:If it's a 220 with stock piston... replace it with a WISCO.

The first time I tore my bike down... the KIPS arm had never moved since new.... still had a dab of grease on the claw gear.... So, I took everything apart, cleaned well and reassembled it.... It then moved and worked perfectly. I imagine yours is stuck like mine was. Never did figure out why....
Thanks Inda!


Couple more questions.

Did you have to have to pull the side cases and get into the lower end of the shaft to looosen things up or just disassemble and clean the parts from the claw gear up?

When reassembling should the claw gear be turned a gear or 2 to the right from the current position (as displayed in the picture above) or is the shaft slotted or something that gives it only one fixed position?

Do I need to apply blue or red loctite when replacing the the (left-handed) nut on the actuator shaft?


Oh, and the bike has already had the Wiseco swap. :supz:
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"That's not flying, it's falling............with Style"
'99 Honda CR250R (Keith)
'99 Honda CR250R (Wilson 15)
'00 Yamaha YFM350 Warrior (Travis 13)
'90 Kawasaki 220 Bayou (Farm Toy)
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Post by Indawoods »

I don't recommend what I did....

After I disassembled everything and cleaned it well... I took my channel locks and grabbed the claw and manually moved it through the range. :oops:

What I would do now is take the cover off and massage the actuator without the rod attached.
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****'95 KDX 200/****

"People ate cows a thousand years ago for the same reason we eat them now. Cause they are easy to catch.We're not savages,we're just lazy. A cheetah could taste like chocolate heroin. But will never know. Those bastards are fast!!! "
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doctord23
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Post by doctord23 »

I think the flapper should be down when the kips is closed if I remember right and go up as the shaft rotates.
Put a 10mm wrench on the nut and see if the shaft can turn clockwise (the worst that could happen is that it unscrews because it is a left-handed thread) while you watch in the exhaust port. Probably a good idea to support the shaft while you are doing it with vise grips.
The sub-valves on each side of the cylinder should be closed and open as you rotate the shaft. If not, the head and cylinder need to come off to see where the problem is. This will give you a chance to check if the piston has been changed.
You can also take the left KIPS cover off. The sub-valve port should be open and close as you rotate the shaft.

FYI, there should not be any oil of residue under the right side shaft cover, it is sealed. The left side probably will be messy.
My Team Green:
2002 KX-KDX 220
2000 KDX 220
2003 KLX 300 DS
1988 White KDX 200C3
1984 KX500 (original owner)
1996 Honda Magna V4
2017 Honda Africa Twin DCT
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Indawoods
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Post by Indawoods »

The flapper goes in and out as opposed to up and down changing the volume of the exhaust port.
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"People ate cows a thousand years ago for the same reason we eat them now. Cause they are easy to catch.We're not savages,we're just lazy. A cheetah could taste like chocolate heroin. But will never know. Those bastards are fast!!! "
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Post by luckymick »

Ok! Due to an excessive amount of work at my job in the last 2 weeks I haven't been able to attend to the KDX. Have all the parts, put it together (sans seat an plastics). Did my first part of the three part break-in cycle: Started the bike (second kick - no gas in carb). Ran the RPM's up/down did not let it idle. Did this for about 6 mins. Radiators were almost too hot to touch. The bike is presently in the cool down cycle. In about 2-3 hours I will start it again for 5-6 mins; varying RPM's and then shut it down until our Thanksgiving trip next weekend!

Now, compression. Took three measurements:
Measurement 1: After five kicks the dial read 187 PSI
Measurement 2: (cleared dial) after three kicks reading was 153 PSI
Measurement 3: (cleared dial) after three kicks reading was 151 PSI

Am I in the ballpark for an new top-end on a 220R?

Thanks,

Mike
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Post by luckymick »

Gentlemen,

Thank you for all of your support!

Ran the bike - (well my son did) - for 80 miles this Thanksgiving week. He absolutely loves the KDX! Up hills, sand-washes, wooop'd trails the bike performed great throughout the powerband.

First top-end and I'm glad all went well.

... and now I know what you guys mean by KIPS rattle!!! WOW!

Great bike for my son. If it were mine I'd be doing the rear shock and going down the KX 250 fork upgrade.

Thanks again all! - Mike
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Indawoods
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Post by Indawoods »

:supz:
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****'95 KDX 200/****

"People ate cows a thousand years ago for the same reason we eat them now. Cause they are easy to catch.We're not savages,we're just lazy. A cheetah could taste like chocolate heroin. But will never know. Those bastards are fast!!! "
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