'Hypothetically'

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sasrocks
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'Hypothetically'

Post by sasrocks »

what would be the result if the left and right KIPS subport valves were installed in the wrong sides? would the system 'function', but the exhaust subports be open when supposed to be closed, and vice versa?

inquiring minds want to know...

hi Brad!
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motorider200
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Post by motorider200 »

I think it would still function but when in the open position the ports would be somwhat blocked off and not flow right.
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Post by canyncarvr »

re: Still function

Yeah. If 'function' means they would turn as they are supposed to.

But...you know all about that, 'eh?


BTW (for the casual peruser), the sub port valves ARE commonly reversed/swapped.....'cuz the manual SAYS to put 'em in wrong.

There is an addendum in some manuals that fix the ID of the Left/Right sup port drums/ rods. Kawi has said they weren't going to republish the manual..that the addendum would suffice, but other riders have told me that THEIR manuals have been corrected in the manual body and HAVE NO addendum.

Whatever works. Just pay attention when you take 'em out (IF you're the one taking them out that is).

The right sub port drum has a groove on the top and the right valve rod has an o-ring.

Oh...the 'right' side is not the 'right' when you're lookin' at it....in case anyone is keeping track.

Howdy Inda!! :wink: (old joke...never mind........)

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Post by sasrocks »

can the subport valves be swapped after only the head is pulledd? Or does the cylinder need to be pulled as well?
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Post by Indawoods »

The only limitation is the frame... other than that...you can do anything to the KIPS assembly. :wink:
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Post by sasrocks »

well I confirmed the subport valves are installed on the wrong sides (left is right hole and vice versa). Culprit = incorrect manual pp 4-12.

the question of the neccesity of removing the cylinder arises because another web site states that can the subport valves swapped can be accomplished by only pulling the head.

A literal reading of the service manual reveals the order of dissasembly includes:

a cylinder
b main valve cover
c resonator
d main valve holder
e main shaft nut
f valve rod plugs
g main valve holder bolts
h left pinion / main shaft
j main valve.... THEN FINALLY
k subport valves

the reason for a) is to get at b,d, f g, and j, access to which is blocked by the frame.

I am asking if the subport valves can be properly switched to their correct positions (and aligned correctly with the exhaust valve rods) without removing all the aforementioned parts.

thanks!
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Indawoods
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Post by Indawoods »

You will have to pull the head...that's a given...it come through the top. And the rest will at least have to come out partially to do it. You will want to pull the exhaust so you can time them right... So...yeah, that's pretty much correct. You should be able to do it with the cylinder on the bike but would be a whole lot easier if it wasn't.
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Post by sasrocks »

thanks for the reply. will let you know how it goes!
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Post by ChuckyBoy »

In order to get the notches, grooves, and punch marks all lined up properly, you'll need to be able to get a good look into the cavities where the sub valves slip into.

Assuming you can get them out with the cylinder still on the bike, I think you'd be hard pressed to get the sub valves in properly while the jug is still on.

If you try it, let us know how it works out. That bit of information could prove useful one day.

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Post by sasrocks »

Just ocmpleted the job. you have to pull the cylinder. the shafts need to come out so you can swap the valves. new gasket kit. Thanks for the accurate manual info KAWI!!! :evil:
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canyncarvr
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Post by canyncarvr »

And it runs differently........how??

Post is time stamped just after noon on a Saturday...so OBviously you had time to go riding!!??

Well???

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Post by KDXer »

Yeah,,,, Hmmmmmm ?!?!?! :lol:
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Post by jackpiner57 »

Whadjya crash it? :twisted:
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Post by sasrocks »

damn this is a hard crowd :butthead:

while in final assembly i discovered my throttle card was completely knackered. the thing was frayed nearly clean through where it makes the 90 degree turn into the carb., due to that piece broken off where it screws into the brass colored cable holder . so NO RIDE REPORT YET hopefully this weekend. :mrgreen:
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Post by KDXer »

Ohhhh :sad: Not to worry.
















Is it fixed yet ?!?!?! :lol: :razz:
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Post by canyncarvr »

Completely knackered?

...sounds very aussie-like to me! Do we need KayDee to translate?

If you're ordering parts for your carb you will likely have better luck getting it FROM a kawi dealer-type (like RonAyers). My last Sudco order I got some carb top parts pretty much for my spares tub. Well, I thought I did. Sudco didn't 'know' Kawi part numbers. From my description of what I wanted the sales guy was certain he knew what parts I wanted.

He was wrong.

The cable adapter, jam nut and retaining clip were evidently for a 'Keihin' PWK, not a 'Kawi' PWK.

Not sure what piece it is you are referring to that is 'broken off', but don't expect any assistance in that area of the carb from Sudco when it comes to ordering parts.

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Post by sasrocks »

Knackered: jacked up, fubared, shredded, at end of useful life cycle, crapped on, fragged, grenaded, f*cked, farged, screwed, blued and tatooed, and so on.

I got bent over on parts but it wsghould be together by Friday. Will report on performance. KIPS seems to be sticking on return (engine off) does not want to come fully closed after engagement. Normal w engine off?
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Post by m0rie »

Did you clean the KIPS and the passages completely?
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Post by canyncarvr »

re: sticking

Not to get too picky....but I'd say 'sticking' isn't quite the same as being a bit slow. It's not unusual for the return of a manually activated KIPS to be a bit slow. It will not generally S-N-A-P! back with a resounding C-L-I-C-K!! when the main rod hits the detent ball.

That's normally the case after running the bike for months and maybe the KIPS is on the 'less than stellar clean' side of things.

I wouldn't worry about it. Check in after your next ride to see how things have 'seated' in.

BTW...that detent ball and spring are something commonly removed to let the KIPS engage without having to overcome the added resistance.

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Post by sasrocks »

good replies.

KIPS is clean as top end was done about 3 running hours ago.

Questions

When manually engaging a clicking is hear early in the engagement cycle. Is this normal?

when manually engaged and left to its own device, it will fail to completely disengage ON ITS OWN. lacks about 10-15 degrees of closwise rotation from completely disengaging on its own (motor off). Is this norma or a problem? I am faily confident the KIPS mechanism residing in the jugs is ok. Could there be a resistance problem in the clutch area?


Removing the spring and ball will ahave what effect exactly? the bolt had 2 washers and I removed one under the presumption that more pressure would provide more resistance and promote a bit of a hit when the KIPS did overcome that resistance and engage.

Need more HIT!!
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