Alternate Premix

[80elkster]

Well I'm running out of the Mobil 1 premix that I bought up when they quit making it and the big store that sold Amsoil Interceptor went out of business so I'm looking for some other premix that won't gum up the power valve (KIPS) that is readily available. You guys have any long term experience with other premix oils in your KDX?

[Colorado Mike]

I used to use Maxxima synthetic, not sure of the exact name. It seemed to do a lot better than the Bel ray that I used for a short time. I like the Amzoil Intercepter better though.

[fuzzy]

Motul 800 is good.

[Mr. Wibbens]

Jerry liked the smell of my Redline a couple weeks ago, he thought it smelled like bean oil

I'm gonna give Lucas a shot next. I can get it for about 6 bux a quart

Last time I bought Maxima it was about 8 bux for a pint

[Indawoods]

Smell leads to taste....

[canyncarvr]

Re: 'I used to use Maxxima synthetic, not sure of the exact name..'

K2


The 'big store' that used to sell Interceptor 'round here went under, too. G.I. Joes..then changed the name to just 'Joes'. There was an Amsoil seller that opened a place right across the street from the shop..he quit after a few weeks.

On-line prices doubled when oil prices went up. When oil prices came down..Amsoil prices didn't. Well (just checked)...down $3.60 from the $40 it went to. It was $20. Talking about gallon pricing.

Anyway...I don't have any answer to your question, but if/when you find something you like I'd appreciate hearing about it.

Good Luck.

[zomby woof]

I think any of the big name stuff is more than good enough, but when I asked this question a few years ago, I got an interesting answer from one of my riding buddies.
He told me that when he rode 2 strokes, he never used anything other than Castrol super 2 stroke, and never had a problem. That oil is about half the price of the big name stuff, and that guy is our local #1 pro rider, so he's not easy on equipment.

[Indawoods]

Not easy on it, rebuilds often and does not have a KIPS system like the KDX.... Did I miss anything?

[Mr. Wibbens]

Not easy on it, rebuilds often and does not have a KIPS system like the KDX.... Did I miss anything?

Just what I was thinking

Prolly rebuilds often

He could prolly get buy using Quaker State

[canyncarvr]

This wasn't started as a 'what oil is best' thread..and that's not the point of this post.

BUT...Castrol 'Super 2 Stroke' is a TCW3 spec'd oil.

If that's what you want to run, fine. Just know what it is.




What's wrong with Quaker State? I ran QS 30W motor oil in my first 2T Yammy twin (R5). Had about 60,000 miles on it (one rebuild a few thousand before that) when some butt stole it. I got up to 1000 miles (injected) out of quart!!

No power valve though......

OK...that was just a typical 'best oil' comment............

[Mr. Wibbens]

I thought only old guys used Quaker State

[zomby woof]

I wasn't recommending any oil. I just joined this forum, and the last thing I want to do is start a fight.
Only pointing out that even cheap stuff would probably work fine.
My buddy did a piston/ring once a year, and I looked, it's not TCW3.
We used Valvoline 2 stroke oil in my sons KDX, and never had any problems over several years. Now that's some cheap premix
Use whatever you're comfortable with.

[SS109]

I guess I'm old school in that I still use the standard Golden Spectro.

Curious, what are the problems people are seeing with certain brands/grades of 2t where it concerns the KIPS valve?

[Indawoods]

GUM... to the point it quits working.

[Tedh98]

This wasn't started as a 'what oil is best' thread..and that's not the point of this post.

BUT...Castrol 'Super 2 Stroke' is a TCW3 spec'd oil.

If that's what you want to run, fine. Just know what it is.

canyncarvr - What are the ramifications of using a TCW3 oil?

Thanks

[Mr. Wibbens]

We'll find out soon enuf with the Lucas

[Julien D]

TC-W3 is a high ash content oil, used generally in non-powervalved marine engines. In an engine with power valves, the high ash content could cause excessive buildup around the valves. Not good...

The Lucas oil is tc-w3, but it's a low ash content oil. Dunno how that fits in or why they're callin in tc-w3.

[fuzzy]

The harder you ride the less important a clean oil is. If I was running all day long in the desert at 50+ I'd run pure castor. The last thing I'd run in the woods. The modern synthetics, especially ones tailored for lower RPM riding w/ powervalves, are all-around great.

[canyncarvr]

I understand a TCW3 oil NOT to have a high ash detergent....2T oils in general don't use high ash detergents. I'd appreciate documentation to the contrary.


The TCW3 specification comes from the National Marine Manufacturers Association ..NMMA. The NMMA TCW3 standard was designed by the various manufacturers of outboard motors (Mercury, OMC, Yamaha etc.). These manufacturers do not utilize power valves, limit their max rpms to about 6800, and have excessive cooling capacity.

It's not that an oil 'built' to TCW3 specs is bad. It's simply TCW3. It was DESIGNED for something completely different from our application.

Again..it's not BAD...it is what it is. There are reasons why Bombardier specifically prohibits the use of TCW oils in their Rotax engines....go back to the above; power valves, low rpm, LOTS of cooling capacity part of the TCW# spec.


I'd like to say I have all this stuff filed away in my head someplace..but I don't. I recall the basics, but refer to an article I've read through quite a few times in the past to get the pacifics. The following article is where 90% of the above information comes from:

CLICKY THIS!


It's like reading through an old Jenks article..chock FULL of great stuff.



Hhhmmm...Jenks. Is that right? Fuzzy would know. Maybe it's Jenkins.

Anyway.....pour yourself a cupp'a..and read through that article. Yep...it is written around PWCs. That makes nothing said in it any less a fact.

A true fact even!


Tedh98: Does this answer your questions?


An anecdotal input: When I changed injector oil on my last RD to a TCW3 spec oil FROM the same brand oil that was NOT TCW3..it got a new lease on life. An RD is an air-cooled, non-PV'd engine. The power increase was incredible. My mpg went up over 10%. I could ride down the highway @ 70mph, packed for a week, with the throttle around 1/4...and the engine would be 4T-skippy happy. I could ride with bikes 2-3X my size..and they couldn't keep up! Well...as long as it was curvy. I'm not saying I could keep ahead of a 100hp bike if the road was straight!

[Mr. Wibbens]

TLDNR