Chain wear

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JoeR
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Chain wear

Post by JoeR »

I have never ridden with other dirt bikers, so I have nothing to compare this to.... I put a non-oring chain on my bike. With 12/49 gearing (and maybe with other gearing too...haven't tried it) the outside perimeter of the chain was seeing a lot of wear in comparison to the inside perimeter. Eventually it wore my master link clip unitl it came loose. It never wore the chain badly, but it was always highly polished.

My non-oring chain didn't last too long, and I replaced it with a DID Oring yesterday. Of course it is still rubbing. I ride a lot of mud/water. This seems to really accelerate the wear.

My questions are:
Is this normal?
Is it caused by my 49 tooth sprocket forcing the chain into the guide?
Should I do something to minimize it?
Is the master link clip a wear-replace item?

Joe
Last edited by JoeR on 08:26 pm Jul 09 2008, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by scheckaet »

Is the master link clip a wear-replace item?
I always have to replace the master link 1 or 2 X during the life of the chain, cuz the clip wears really fast and becomes paper thin...
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Post by Mr. Wibbens »

I only run D.I.D non o ring on my kdx (o-ring waste of money on a dirt bike, says me ) :wink:
And it is easier to take care of 'em IMHO

I've not had any masterlink wear issues :?

I run 12/48
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Post by fuzzy »

2nd the chain guide...It's the only thing that should be touching the sides of the chain.

2nd the non o-ring chain too, but buy a good one like Wibs said.
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Post by canyncarvr »

My master link always wears thin...like sheckaet said. Makes no difference with a new block..which I've had quite a few of (so it's not a matter of width of anything).

I figure there are 108 links rubbing the groove in the block of the guide..and only one that's a bit wider. That ratio evidently doesn't result in the guide block being as wide as that one link.

That said, DO check your guide blocks for wear.

I replace my master link clip when it gets 'too thin'. ..whatever THAT is. It's a figure I come up more readily if I happen to have a spare link/clip on hand!

:roll:
Last edited by canyncarvr on 05:27 pm Jul 09 2008, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by scheckaet »

I always carry an extra link, just in case...
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Post by canyncarvr »

Me, too!! Although it has a thin clip on it!! :neutral:

But...no extra links (which may well be needed to make a master useable.

AND...no breaker tool to get anything apart that needs to come apart.

:hmm: How sensible is that?

(No response to that necessary)

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Post by scheckaet »

don't need no frigin breaker, just a couple o stick, some McGyver engineering and it's good to go. :supz:
Just hope the only thing that'll break will be the master :?
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Post by JoeR »

I'm glad that I'm not the only one that is wearing out the master link clip. That makes me feel a little better. I will definitely check to see that the guide is lined up correctly, but I don't expect to find a problem. The whole outer perimeter of the chain is visibly rubbed, not just the right or left side of it. It still doesn't hurt to look at it though. Thanks for suggesting it.
What do you guys not like about an O-Ring chain? The reason that I chose to put one on was because if I rode in dry conditions I didn't have unusual wear. If I was in wet muddy stuff, like I normally ride in, then I can wear it fast enough that I need to adjust it in 30 miles of riding to keep it from falling off. I am hoping that an O-ring chain will resist mud intrusion and not wear out so darn fast. One thing for sure....time will tell.

Thanks everyone for the replies.

Joe
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Post by Mr. Wibbens »

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Post by canyncarvr »

When I said 'check for wear' I wasn't referring to the width but the depth of wear. It's going to wear to as wide as it needs to...no problem. But..when the depth gets close to the bottom two screws (bolts) that hold the block in the guide, it's time to put in a new one! The chain will wear right though the fasteners, but that's a problem on a couple of different levels.

I've been making my own blocks from a hunk of teflon (green) hi-density stuff. Mark the outline of an old block to the new stock, cut with a jigsaw, smooth with a rasp/file, drill it, mount it. Beats BUYing one.

There were some on ebay sometime back that were cheaper than messing with making them. I haven't seen them for a few years.

Wibby's posted vid does make a point. But...form should follow function. The function of the chain is to be the final drive of your bike. While it's nice to have that final drive be a low rolling resistance, in the overall scheme of things it's more important that it keep doing what it's supposed to for an acceptable (to you) amount of time.

A very good non-oring chain isn't cheap. The better it's taken care of, the longer it will last. Anecdotally...I usually get a year and 1/2 or two out of chain/sprocket set. Of course, that means nothing particularly..it's more about time, conditions and such.

I would expect that a chain that requires adjustment in 30 miles of riding (regardless of riding conditions) is not a very good chain to start with. Yanno...kind of like the crap OEM chain the 200 (non-oring) comes with off the showroom floor.

Browse around here for some chain comparisons. When a plain jane 520 chain costs $30, and a 'good' one is about $200...you know they probably ain't quite the same thang.
Last edited by canyncarvr on 11:46 am Jul 13 2008, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by fuzzy »

Indeed. Big difference between cheap and expensive chains.

The thing I hate about o-rings on a dirtbike is....while it will 'help' keep stuff out for a while, crud eventually gets in there, and doesn't come out...Then it gets stiff...PITA to get really clean, etc. Non-o-ring just powerwash it w/ the bike, and lube. If you don't anally take care of the o-ring it will eventially start to bind way before it's worn out. Years ago I saw a friend get chucked into a tree, breaking his collar bone, hauling balls on an 250R when his o-ring chain bound at the primary sprocket/guard...Locking his rear. While he didn't take the best care of it, it wasn't completely neglected either. We had just been in a TON of mud/sandy crud that day. I never ran an o-ring chain again....Never had any probs w/ chain life either except when I chinsed on the chain.

O-ring chans are great for keeping lube in on a street bike.
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Post by canyncarvr »

You mean my chain ain't supposed to look like this:

--/--____~/./---__~_`_--

:shock:

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Post by JoeR »

I took my new O-ring chain out for a good run today. I've got a couple of observations.
First, I like this chain much better. I traversed deep mud, deep water, sand, dirt gravel and open roads. It barely gained any length at all. It took a serious beating and showed little signs of wear. (my last one must have been a real crummy one)
It doesn't get hot like my other chain did.

A couple of you warned about not running an O-ring chain. Fuzzy said that eventually they get dirt in them and bind up. My ride today was probably about 70 miles. I lubed the chain with chain wax before leaving, and by the end of the ride most every link was kinking...not binding, but not straightening out under it's own weight. Maybe that's normal for one of these.

So, we'll see how long it lasts, but for now I am REALLY happy that I can run it without having to adjust it every hour or two.

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Post by Mr. Wibbens »

Nothing will FUBAR a chain faster than chain wax in the dirt

Works ok on the street but you have to clean it often or it'll gunk up the chain
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Post by KarlP »

maybe I'm the odd man out here..........wouldn't be unusuall

I run an o-ring on my bike, have for years.

A middle of the road chain, new sprockets and I'm good for a year, year and a half. Three rear tires, generally, depends if I race or not.

I don't lube it, I don't wash it, and I don't adjust tension.

What happens is I'll put it on, adjust tension to the tight side of allowable. It will quickly loosen to a point and stay there untill the sprockets give up. I can adjust tension once or twice at the end of its life but it'll give up pretty quick. It is usually the front sprocket teeth that start snapping off.

I have used a high dollar chain ($200) and did not get much better life out of it.

Seems I go $80 dollar chain, $20 front sprocket, $60 back sprocket, I think.
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Post by canyncarvr »

Karl: Sorry. You're not that odd......... :wink:

Well, not on this matter, anyway.

My experience has been similar. It's a matter of weighing what matters. If I get 5% increased longevity out of a final drive set by doing 'something' with it (taking care to clean it to a picky cleanliness, say), but it takes a considerably amount of time to DO that 'something'...why bother, 'cuz it's not worth it (to me).

I take what I consider to be reasonable care. I get pretty much the same life out of it you indicate you get. I've tried spending more $$ on it to see what happens...with the same result as you.

I guess that could make both of us odd-n-out.

:hmm:

Nah! THAT couldn't be it.

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Post by KarlP »

Back to the original posters question....

The clip on the master link is what shows wear. I can tell it is still on the chain because it is the only shiny piece on the chain. I have lost that clip on a ride and only stopped because the outer plate fell off and the rest of link started backing out and jammed in the chain guide. I had a spare master link but no clip. I stripped some thin copper wire out of a nearby burned out car and wrapped it into the grooves the clip fits in.

It got me home.

The point is the clip fell off because one of the pins in the master link wore down so much the groove disapeared. I could only wrap the copper wire into one of pin grooves 'cause only one pin still had a groove.

The master link is a wear item
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Post by JoeR »

Just a short follow-up here....
I did a Poker Run last week. 149 miles of all kinds of riding, inlcuding some mud and water. I was running it pretty hard the whole time. Before the ride I washed the chain wax off it with hot soapy water...at least I think I washed it off.... becaue Mr Wibby said chain wax was a bad idea on a dirt bike.
I ran some chain lube on it. It is still on the original adjustment. It hasn't stretched a bit. The Chain Lube seems to have eliminated the kinking i experienced on the first ride.
So, I am pretty happy with my new chain. As one of you pointed out, I probably just had a crappy chain on it before, because this one is wearing like iron in comparison, and I'm riding the same as I did before.

Thanks for the help.
I appreciate it.
Joe
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Post by fuzzy »

Just keep your eye on it....Those 'kinks' are death when a 'kink' runs through your sprocket guard, or guide, and don't un-kink. I'm sure what I described is in fact rare, but I never wanted to see it again. Plenty of folks run them.
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