Hey Guys,
am I glad I found this site (Through a link at DRN) even!
I had always believed that o ring chains sapped horsepower
and with my '03 KDX200 having one on it I was going to take it off
next time I needed a Sprocket chain set.
I talked to "The Man"
(No not Roger Decoster,The other Man Jeff Freddette)
and he said a Warmed up o ring chain has less friction then a standard chain.
Is keeping the Oring chain the Norm?
Tony
O ring Chain Fact or Fiction?
- Oldschool
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A good name X or O ring chain is just what the KDX needs. There aint no way anyone can say that one of these good chains, not a Chung Chow FooK Mi knock off brand, causes enough resistance to sap significant HP like some say, like .0245 HP. Take a good dump before you ride and loose that 12 lbs to make up for the .0245 HP loss.
'04 220 w/'01 KX250 USD forks, '02 RM125 Showa shock, Rekluse EXP 3.0, LHRB & all RB'd
- canyncarvr
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Welcome!
I don't know that you will find anything other than 'always believed' here.
So.....an o-ring warms up?
**edit** My error. It wasn't stated that the o-rings warm up..but that an o-ring chain warms up. Certainly it does that.
Consider: The purpose of the o(or x or whatever)-ring is to seal the 'seam' of the roller and the side plate. It seals stuff in (grease/lubricants) and out (dirt/crud/water/AND junk).
A non-o-ring chain relies on the proximity/fit of the roller to the side plate.
I've seen lots of o-ring chains (mine for example) that are sort'a kinky, and that is when it's clean and the o-rings are lubricated. Do those kinks come from the links having a better slip than a non-o-ring chain? No.
So, which will show less resistance to movement?
The point of my drivel is to state some common sense reasons that show an o-ring chain indeed has greater resistance to link movement than does a non-o-ring chain.
Anecdotally speaking, I got only a couple (literally) rides out of my OEM KDX200 non-o-ring chain before it was toast. I generally get over a year's use out of a sealed chain.
I am familiar with chain maintenance methods/procedures and generally do it, too.
In the end, the 'always believed' is likely what you will get.
Some will swear by 'regular' chains, some by o-ring chains. Some (and most here know who) believe that a 'regular' chain that is 'taken care' of will last every bit as long/well as an o-ring chain.
For all I know, you're him and you're just looking for some fun by bringing up the subject!
How an o-ring chain (when warm of course) has less friction than a standard chain computes in no way to me.
Whatever...........
**edit**
Maybe these guys know something:
http://www.didchain.com/xring1.htm
Check the 'wear' graph. No..that's not friction. I'm talking about the advisability of using a ringed chain, 0/x/twistedx/t..you name it.
BTW...if o-ring chains have less friction than standard chains, howcome MX'rs don't use them?
I don't know that you will find anything other than 'always believed' here.
So.....an o-ring warms up?
**edit** My error. It wasn't stated that the o-rings warm up..but that an o-ring chain warms up. Certainly it does that.
Consider: The purpose of the o(or x or whatever)-ring is to seal the 'seam' of the roller and the side plate. It seals stuff in (grease/lubricants) and out (dirt/crud/water/AND junk).
A non-o-ring chain relies on the proximity/fit of the roller to the side plate.
I've seen lots of o-ring chains (mine for example) that are sort'a kinky, and that is when it's clean and the o-rings are lubricated. Do those kinks come from the links having a better slip than a non-o-ring chain? No.
So, which will show less resistance to movement?
The point of my drivel is to state some common sense reasons that show an o-ring chain indeed has greater resistance to link movement than does a non-o-ring chain.
Anecdotally speaking, I got only a couple (literally) rides out of my OEM KDX200 non-o-ring chain before it was toast. I generally get over a year's use out of a sealed chain.
I am familiar with chain maintenance methods/procedures and generally do it, too.
In the end, the 'always believed' is likely what you will get.
Some will swear by 'regular' chains, some by o-ring chains. Some (and most here know who) believe that a 'regular' chain that is 'taken care' of will last every bit as long/well as an o-ring chain.
For all I know, you're him and you're just looking for some fun by bringing up the subject!
How an o-ring chain (when warm of course) has less friction than a standard chain computes in no way to me.
Whatever...........
**edit**
Maybe these guys know something:
http://www.didchain.com/xring1.htm
Check the 'wear' graph. No..that's not friction. I'm talking about the advisability of using a ringed chain, 0/x/twistedx/t..you name it.
BTW...if o-ring chains have less friction than standard chains, howcome MX'rs don't use them?
Last edited by canyncarvr on 04:12 pm Nov 08 2006, edited 1 time in total.
Consider the source
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Non impediti ratione cogitationis
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- canyncarvr
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From HERE!
Once you get beyond the question of length, you move into the age old debate between standard chain versus o-ring chain. Fasse commented, “At Speed Partz we supply both standard and o-ring chain, but almost all of our customers prefer standard chain. I believe if properly cared for, standard chain is the right choice. For one thing, it is significantly lighter and less expensive than o-ring chain.” There was a mass introduction of o-ring chain into the motorcycle industry in the mid eighties because of its relative ease of maintenance. O-ring chain uses tiny rubber seals between each plate to keep grease trapped inside the chains rollers, for longer life. Many people believe that the tiny seals used in o-ring chain create additional friction that keeps the chain from spinning as freely as a standard chain. However, there are manufacturers that claim as the greases in an o-ring chain thin out, they are capable of spinning as freely as non o-ring chain.
More importantly:
A worn, stretched chain puts uneven stresses on the motor and sprockets leading to additional friction and ultimately the loss of power. The bottom line on the dyno testing with a worn chain and a new chain—a worn chain can lead to a 5% loss of power.
(emphasi mine)
Once you get beyond the question of length, you move into the age old debate between standard chain versus o-ring chain. Fasse commented, “At Speed Partz we supply both standard and o-ring chain, but almost all of our customers prefer standard chain. I believe if properly cared for, standard chain is the right choice. For one thing, it is significantly lighter and less expensive than o-ring chain.” There was a mass introduction of o-ring chain into the motorcycle industry in the mid eighties because of its relative ease of maintenance. O-ring chain uses tiny rubber seals between each plate to keep grease trapped inside the chains rollers, for longer life. Many people believe that the tiny seals used in o-ring chain create additional friction that keeps the chain from spinning as freely as a standard chain. However, there are manufacturers that claim as the greases in an o-ring chain thin out, they are capable of spinning as freely as non o-ring chain.
More importantly:
A worn, stretched chain puts uneven stresses on the motor and sprockets leading to additional friction and ultimately the loss of power. The bottom line on the dyno testing with a worn chain and a new chain—a worn chain can lead to a 5% loss of power.
(emphasi mine)
Consider the source
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Non impediti ratione cogitationis
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- canyncarvr
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Note that D.I.D.'s x-ring is supposedly different than 'the other' x-ring.
It's twisted as opposed to squeezed.
I've run an RK-Xring for a couple of sets. I wouldn't know .0245hp from diddle, though.
Consider the source!!
It's twisted as opposed to squeezed.
I've run an RK-Xring for a couple of sets. I wouldn't know .0245hp from diddle, though.
Consider the source!!
Consider the source
Using a perceived level of knowledge to boost my self worth.
Non impediti ratione cogitationis
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- Mr. Wibbens
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DID makes a new Enduro model T ring which is narrower
I've been using a D.I.D. ERT gold non O ring chain for the last couple years, O rings are just too kinky for me (Not that there's anything wrong with that)
I've been using a D.I.D. ERT gold non O ring chain for the last couple years, O rings are just too kinky for me (Not that there's anything wrong with that)
doG, I hope NOT!canyncarvr wrote:
For all I know, you're him and you're just looking for some fun by bringing up the subject!
Warning! This member tends to use sarcasm as a regular form of communication. If a post seems offensive, before you panic and fly off the handle, re-read the post and imagine it being said with a sideways grin.
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