Steering head bearings.

Colorado Mike · Post by **Colorado Mike** » 09:25 pm May 12 2006

My bike is an '04, owned only by me. When I got it, I rode a couple times , then tore it down to lube all the bearings. The rear linkage bearings only had what looked to be motor oil on them, but the steering stem bearings had been heavily greased with some kinda thick blue stuff. I left those alone. I rode about a season and a half like that, and I don't ride through much water. Colorado is pretty danged dry.

Tonight I started tearing down the front end to do my KX fork conversion. When I took my Scotts steering damper off, I was shocked at how bumpy my steering fealt. Apparently the damping action masks how bad things really are. Once I got the bearings out, sure enough they look like crap with rust and crud in the bearings. I was pretty surprised at this, since my climate is anything but harsh. Is this normal?

I'm getting the stem swapped into my KX lower clamp tomorrow, and hopefully the shop will have a new set of bearings, but should I go with the stock ones, or is there a better option available? From the looks of these , I should be changing them every year, and I think that's way too soon.

Any hot tips on getting the races in and out? I'd rather not buy any expensive tools.

Thanks.

Post by **Indawoods** » 09:29 pm May 12 2006

Stock is BEST! Runs about $65 from the dealer... just picked mine up tonight.

Just a drift (I used a big @ss screwdriver) and a lead or dead blow hammer is needed to get the old races out. Use a block of wood to set the new races in and top them off with the hammer.... gently. You want to make sure they are flush.

That's it! Job done!

canyncarvr · Post by **canyncarvr** » 11:41 am May 15 2006

Re: Damper masks...

The same is true with just the weight of the forks/wheel and tire. You will miss a whole lot of 'notchy' if you check the steering stem bearings by moving an assembled front end back and forth. You won't feel it until it's REALLY shot.

OEM type (Koyo) are the best. Do NOT put in any Moose/MSR/AllBall substitute. THEY are completely worthless PsOS!

Re: Hot tips

Any drift that's long enough (or one'a those bigga$$ screwdrivers) will work fine. Gently...side to side tapping to get them out. Yeah...you can just beat the hell out of it and get it out, but any side-wise cant to the race isn't helping the stem collar any.

Block of wood to start is fine. But...seating them up inside the collar with a hammer. OUCH! You will be 'pounding' against the thin edge of the race!!

Use the old race to seat the new one. Place it the same way, so if (when) IT gets stuck in the process you will have an 'edge' to take it out from the top.

Put the races in the freezer for awhile (at least 1/2 an hour). NOT a frost free if you have the choice. Protect against moisture (zip lock). Grease (anti-seize is good) the outside of the race before beating.

I think (hope) that Inda's 'flush' means 'square'. The bottom race does fit INside the steering tube. If you do fit it to flush, it will NOT be seated. Expect things to 'get loose' and likely take out the bearings in the process.

While getting 'notchy' is normal (especially if not assembled correctly..too loose), lot'sa crud and corrosion is not.

The Koyo that fits from your local bearing shop will likely NOT have the bottom seal. Said seal is likely NOT removeable from the old bearing...and if it WAS, why would you want to use it?

I recall CBR does NOT have steering bearings for the KDX. Call to be sure if you wish. R.Ayers with shipping cost as much as the local Kaw shop for me.

You already know all of that...but you asked.

Post by **Indawoods** » 11:58 am May 15 2006

Them's races be hard!
I don't think a lead or plastic deadblow will hurt 'em one little bit!

canyncarvr · Post by **canyncarvr** » 12:20 pm May 15 2006

How do you hit just the edge of the race to get it UP inside the tube with a hammer?

You would be a better hammer handler than I!

Post by **Indawoods** » 12:21 pm May 15 2006

You don't. That was a silly question Mr. Carver!

Old Race of course....

canyncarvr · Post by **canyncarvr** » 12:29 pm May 15 2006

Inda wrote:Use a block of wood to set the new races in and top them off with the hammer.... gently.

Silly me. I missed the 'old race' part!!

Post by **Indawoods** » 12:53 pm May 15 2006

Would it make you feel better if the head of my hammer is the same size as the lower races?

canyncarvr · Post by **canyncarvr** » 12:59 pm May 15 2006

Which got me to the 'better hammer handler' than me!

THAT would be a darn good aim!

Heck...I was pounding on Cindy's Banshee rear axle with a 12# hammer (well, splitting maul)...and missed once..hit the fender!

But after a good while of holding the pipe against the axle spider with one hand, and the 12#er in the other and beating on it for awhile...I was losing my grip on a few things...like my temper!

crazybrit · Post by **crazybrit** » 07:06 pm May 16 2006

canyncarvr wrote:Re:
Use the old race to seat the new one. Place it the same way, so if (when) IT gets stuck in the process you will have an 'edge' to take it out from the top.

I always use a dremel (cutting disk) and make a thin clean cut through the outer race and then deburr it.

Use this to drive it in. Even if you drive it in too far, easy to pop out with a pair of channel locks.

I just finished doing the linkage/swingarm bearings. Guess I get to check steering head bearings next too.

Tony

Post by **Indawoods** » 07:14 pm May 16 2006

For the record... both are recessed.
The bottoms more than the top, which is only slightly recessed.

The old races pop out easy after driving in the new ones....

crazybrit · Post by **crazybrit** » 07:16 pm May 23 2006

canyncarvr wrote:Re: Damper masks...

OEM type (Koyo) are the best. Do NOT put in any Moose/MSR/AllBall substitute. THEY are completely worthless PsOS!

What exactly is wrong with these steering head bearings? Worthless is a strong term. I'm sure Japanese are top quality to be sure but thats a ways from Chinese is worthless. When I asked a local bearing store about this they said it's the legacy that will never die and these days for non industrial uses Japanese/Korean/Chinese are all pretty much a commodity item.

Or is there something specific?

Post by **Indawoods** » 07:36 pm May 23 2006

The seal.... or lack thereof.

The aftermarket bearings are non-sealed and the OEM's are.

Not worthless in the truest sense of the word but why buy aftermarket when OEM's are so much better?

canyncarvr · Post by **canyncarvr** » 11:17 am May 24 2006

re: something specific..

Specifically, I've used...uh, well, in CM's lingo 'Chimese butter..' bearings. They are worthless. 'Worthless' meaning not useful or satisfactory for their intended use and or purpose. As a medallion or maybe an eyebrow stud for KayD they would be fine. As a bearing? Worthless. Not worth the time it takes to install them.

So..what 'exactly' is wrong with them is that they are no good.

If 'worthless' means you cannot preload the bearing without crushing the rollers...then they are not worthless.

If 'worthless' means you can install them just fine..and after a few rides you can install new ones all over again..then they are indeed worthless.

They will likely improve over time and at SOME point they will be worth my time to install...but that time is not now.

RE: 'asked...local bearing store...'

I asked MY 'local' bearing store (CBR)..if he did not use the word 'worthless' it was some other word as good as.

Besides...I think POS is a considerably stronger 'word' than worthless.

Apologies (tongue in cheek) if that offends any 'local bearing store' guy.

Post by **Mr. Wibbens** » 04:30 pm May 24 2006

Think this is serviceable?

http://wibby.smugmug.com/photos/71388898-M.jpg

Maybe a little WD40 will bring 'er back to life!

Post by **Mr. Wibbens** » 04:31 pm May 24 2006

It felt a lil notchy

crazybrit · Post by **crazybrit** » 04:40 pm May 24 2006

Mr. Wibbens wrote:Think this is serviceable?
http://wibby.smugmug.com/photos/71388898-M.jpg

And that's what the "worthless" a/m ones CC is talking about look like when they are new :-))

canyncarvr · Post by **canyncarvr** » 04:42 pm May 24 2006

Actually, Mr. Wibbens cleaned it up a good bit to make it look that good!

Actually, two, that bearing is less than worthless.

Post by **Mr. Wibbens** » 05:30 am May 25 2006

I need to take it apart and see what kinda shape those All Balls bearing are in
They been in there for 3 years and 3 months

m0rie · Post by **m0rie** » 09:20 am May 25 2006

Mr. Wibbens wrote:I need to take it apart and see what kinda shape those All Balls bearing are in
They been in there for 3 years and 3 months

Having just had mine apart (and in the bike for about the same period of time) i'd say mine looked great. Even the lower bearing was in pretty good shape. Rolled nice and smooth, not notchy at all. Regular cleaning is key for the life expectancy of any bearing, more so with the cheap-o bearings.

KDXRIDER.NET

KDXRIDER.NET

Steering head bearings.

Steering head bearings.