Won't idle, no power

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Drodsgarage
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Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

Ok my patience is running thin. 2003 kdx220. Bone stock
Getting is 145, 42. Needle middle position. Oklahoma (500' sea level) got on steal on this bike but have yet to get it to run right. Figured it would be an easy carb clean and go thrash. Bike starts first kick every time. But will no idle no matter where the air screw is or the idle screw. Bike also has no power. When I say no power I don't mean won't wheelie in third on a slight uphill I mean like my wife's tw200 would run all over it...and that things a turd. Smokes only on throttle eccel but definately fogs up the place. Here is what I have done.
CLEANED CARB 2 DOZEN TIMES. IT IS CLEAN, NEW JET BLOCK GASKET, new jets, bowl gasket etc.
Took top end apart and cleaned all KIPS components. Put a new power valve engagement pin in also. Brand new air filter air box is squeeky clean. New boyesen reeds, compression is 150psi. Tried it without the silencer. Between the pipe and silencer there is oil blowby as well onto the swingarm. Sprayed carb cleaner while it running around all joints with no change in rpms. Only thing I haven't done is a leakdown, and checked electrical component specs. I dont feel loke it would be crankseals because it starts so easy and seems to be running overly rich. Running 32:1 good gas and belray oil
Help me out guys. I'm a John Deere field mechanic and between working so much 2 kids and free time going to working on this. I'm ready to be riding!! Thanks in advance.
2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
Drodsgarage
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Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

Also like I said it will start immediately with no choke. If I pull out the choke it won't run. Don't know if that helps. Also has a brand new petcock. Not OEM but similar, just a bit shorter.
I have purchased basket cases in boxes of parts and had them running in no time. This bike barely has boot rub on the frame and not a single dent in the factory expansion pipe and it's kicking my ass lol. Think its ridiculous you have to split the cases to change the crank seals. Has anybody ever dremeled down the outer seal stops so they could be changed in an hour vs 8?
2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
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SS109
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Won't idle, no power

Post by SS109 »

Have you checked your timing? The woodruff key might have sheared and thrown the timing off. Do the leakdown test. Seriously, just do it. It is a diagnostic tool. You've tried everything else, yes? So do it! It will start just fine even if it's leaking through the right crank seal. Right seal leak would make a lot of nasty spooge.
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John_S
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by John_S »

Recently someone on here was having a hell of a time and it ended up being a rag that he stuffed in the intake and forgot about. It'll drive you nuts and then end up being something small in the end that fixes it. I agree with SS on the next two steps to try.

Have you ran wire (or better yet guitar string) through the passages of the carb? It acts like the pilot circuit is clogged.
Drodsgarage
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

SS109 wrote:Have you checked your timing? The woodruff key might have sheared and thrown the timing off. Do the leakdown test. Seriously, just do it. It is a diagnostic tool. You've tried everything else, yes? So do it! It will start just fine even if it's leaking through the right crank seal. Right seal leak would make a lot of nasty spooge.
No haven't checked that yet. I see if I have the stuff in the garage to throw together a leakdown tester. I will check timing as well. I think I just so badly don't want it to be a crank seal that I'm avoiding it lol. I've only experienced left side seal failure and the bike wouldn't start at all.

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2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
Drodsgarage
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

John_S wrote:Recently someone on here was having a hell of a time and it ended up being a rag that he stuffed in the intake and forgot about. It'll drive you nuts and then end up being something small in the end that fixes it. I agree with SS on the next two steps to try.

Have you ran wire (or better yet guitar string) through the passages of the carb? It acts like the pilot circuit is clogged.
Yeah I have cleaned the carb to a point of aggravating myself lol. But...never know. And yeah hahaha I read the thread about the ol boy who done that [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]. He was about done with dirtbikes all together lol.

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2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by ohgood »

the next time I need to do a seal, yes I'm going to dremel the case. assuming there isn't excessive play in the crank bearings. you're a tech, you know how to access that, right ? cool.

the 220 will become a dog when the carb is worn out. mine did, it sucked to spend tons of effort on it and then realize a $160 carb made it better.

check your timing, advance it fully, it will wake up the engine.
Drodsgarage
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

ohgood wrote:the next time I need to do a seal, yes I'm going to dremel the case. assuming there isn't excessive play in the crank bearings. you're a tech, you know how to access that, right ? cool.

the 220 will become a dog when the carb is worn out. mine did, it sucked to spend tons of effort on it and then realize a $160 carb made it better.

check your timing, advance it fully, it will wake up the engine.
Okay, may have gotten lucky. Toddler was tuggin my pant leg to watch me ride so...i ride lol knew I didn't have much gas left. Well ran like it usually does bahhhhhhbahhhhh no weeeeeee. Well sucker started running good! Than died. I'm thinking my float isn't set right? I set by holding the carb up right and slowly drop it to a 45 and go off if the casting lines. Also blow through the inlet and slowly push the bowl up until it seets etc. Thinking if I drop my float even more it might resolve this. Or just buy the little float tube.

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2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
Drodsgarage
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

Needs some help guys. I've adjusted the bowl two or three different times and at this point is much more than the 16mm +/- 2mm. more like 20,21mm. Still runs like a dog untill the fuel starts running out than I'll get a couple nice brapps out of it, than it runs a very lean condition (as expected) than dies. Not sure what's going on.

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2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
Akbell
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Akbell »

Sounds like what I just went through. Get a new stator, and check your timing. Mine was completely backwards. Set it right and runs like a beast. Sounds like you've done all the other trouble shooting stuff.
Drodsgarage
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

Akbell wrote:Sounds like what I just went through. Get a new stator, and check your timing. Mine was completely backwards. Set it right and runs like a beast. Sounds like you've done all the other trouble shooting stuff.
Your timing was 180 out? I guess I need to check it. I figured fuel but I know that electrical is often times a "fuel" issue. Was your key sheered?

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2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
Akbell
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Akbell »

Yes. Key was smoked.
Drodsgarage
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

Little update - done a leak down test and it had no leakage over 5 min or so. But bike smokes like it's losing tranny fluid, and my tranny fluid level is dropping as well. So kinda scratching my head there. I've tried all sorts of jetting and needle heights to no prevail. Only time I've gotten it to run out right was with the float bowl way over adjustment, but the power band was unpredictable. I pressured to 7lb with piston at tdc. May try to pull vacuum and see if that shows any signs. I'm using a mighty vac so won't be an issue. Where else could I be getting tranny fluid into the crank housing? Bike is kicking my ass! Spark jumps 6mm. Pulled flywheel and all looks perfect in there. But my old reeds back in it because I had about .56 gap on one side of the boyesen reeds (was told I over tightened). Any body have any idea.

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2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
Dekon
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Won't idle, no power

Post by Dekon »

Only 2 ways tranny oil can get in:
1. Bad right side crank seal
2. Crack in the case somewhere

I know you did a leak down test, but that is the only 2 ways that I can think of.
Drodsgarage
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

Dekon wrote:Only 2 ways tranny oil can get in:
1. Bad right side crank seal
2. Crack in the case somewhere

I know you did a leak down test, but that is the only 2 ways that I can think of.
I may do another and also pull vacuum. Bike starts very easily first kick. I've only dealt with a bad left side seal and I know it kept the bike from starting at all. Would a right side cause starting issues? I did 2 tests before the second one I removed the clutch and everything to get a visual on the seal. This motor has never been into and has had no abuse for say. Killing me. May send my carb and head to RB designs on November and see if that doesn't clean it up.

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2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
mliz
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by mliz »

I had the exact same problem you did on my 200. Turned out my carb was worn out (the PO soaked it in some nasty stuff). I cleaned it about 10 times, replaced jet block o-ring, set the float at least that many times, and tried every jetting combination possible to no avail. Finally broke down and got a new carb and she runs like a dream now.


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Drodsgarage
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Drodsgarage »

mliz wrote:I had the exact same problem you did on my 200. Turned out my carb was worn out (the PO soaked it in some nasty stuff). I cleaned it about 10 times, replaced jet block o-ring, set the float at least that many times, and tried every jetting combination possible to no avail. Finally broke down and got a new carb and she runs like a dream now.


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No kidding? Were your symptoms similar to mine? I may have to break down and do that been trying to find someone local who would swap with me so I could rule that out.

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2003 kdx220 bone stock.
2006 tw200 bone stock (wife's ride)
"A man so concerned about football, is a man who has never slung a leg over a dirtbike" - Me
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Re: Won't idle, no power

Post by Friedom »

Well I'm not sure about the oil in the crank case (see how that vac test goes), but check that the silencer isn't clogged with loose packing. When it came loose for me, the bike ran, but lousy, worse with more throttle. Poor thing couldn't breathe.
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