WR450F/WR250F

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Bitteeinit
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WR450F/WR250F

Post by Bitteeinit »

Has anyone ever ridden these bikes? A search reveals we have a few ex or current WR250F owners, but not much more info.

Long story short, I'm thinking of adding a Thumper to my dirt roster. It might mean dumping the KDX, depends on finances for now. After a lot of research, I'm convinced a WR is what I'm after as it's more or less ready for the woods from teh get go and also has some easy/cheap mods. A DRZ might be more DS ready, but I figure I'd be mainly using it as a offroad weapon so prefer the lighter weight of the WRs. I realize that one needs to be honest with oneself when choosing a new bike, since nothing can do it all. I like the KDX, but I hate taking it anywhere long-distance because of the poor mileage and pain of carrying around 2T oil.

Virtually everyone around here I've talked to say the 250 is way better. I've been told one gets too tired with the 450, overwhelming power, fighting the machine and so on. Keep in mind most people are around 5'6" (I'm a slender though strong enough 6'5"). Still, some of the guys I talked to are good riders. I'm scared that after a 2-stroke like the KDX, the WR250F will disappoint me or I'll quickly grow out of it's potential vs the 450 having potential for my whole lifetime. Also, I find the 450s power will be more versatile as realistically, 80% of the trails I ride are more open-type/faster dirt roads. A few times per year I go to some remote places with hardcore tight stuff... The type which totally kills you after 4-5 hours of riding. Getting to distant trails with good gearing might be better on the 450. I also secretly like the idea of being able to power wheelie effortlessly in any gear/situation(logs/roots/puddles).... :grin: Still, I'm told the 250 delivers noticeably more power than the old XR250s, TTR250 and so on, so maybe it's all I need?

Do the 450s really feel THAT much heavier in tighter stuff? As I said, I think I realistically only ride really tight stuff sporadically. The 450 is only a few lbs heavier than it's 250 counterpart (and the KDX), though it apparently does feels more top-heavy. When I do ride tight stuff, it's tight (riding along narrow rice paddy lines, single log bridges etc) so too heavy would be a problem. Still, penty of guys ride KTM450s and XR400s which aren't THAT light. Another reason I'm interested in the 450 is that they cost virtually the same as a 250 here since the 250s are more popular with locals vs the stronger/heavier 450s. It would also means selling it will be harder down the road but whatever... I do plan on renting on of each bike for a day to try them out (though finding a 450 might be hard), I've also read all the threads on thumpertalk and other websites, but figured some fellow KDXers would be able to give me some insight. Has anyone ridden one or both of these bikes? How do they compare to the KDX? How did you like them?
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by 6 Riders »

One of the (ex) members on here went from a WR250 to a KDX.....Only for the ease of maintenance....He did love that WR though.
A 450 has more than just weight of the bike to think about. Rotational mass makes a difference in the feel of the bike as well as actual weight. So yeah, a 450 could kick your @$$, where a 250 would be feather light in comparison, even IF the bike only weighs 20# more.
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by royadams »

My brother has a 12 wr250f I've ridden it several times. It's a nice bike but I prefer his 10 yz250f over it. My friend had a wr450 . It was nice on the fast stuff but could be a real handful when it got tight. He went from the 450 to the new 250 fx . He said he would not go back to the 450. As far as my preference, In a hare scramble I would pick my brothers yz250f with the 290 big bore kit. It's real easy to ride fast. In single track I prefer my kdx 250/ kx 125 hybrid. I'm thinking about getting a yzf for my race bike and just ride my hybrid when we head to the technical stuff.
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WR450F/WR250F

Post by osobad »

I raced a wr250f for a couple of years. I loved that bike . I had a lot of work done to it. 290kit , yz intake cam externinal oil res removed and so on. Faster in woods and easier to ride for long periods than 450 for most. e button helps if you stal in some places
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

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6 Riders wrote:One of the (ex) members on here went from a WR250 to a KDX.....Only for the ease of maintenance....He did love that WR though.
A 450 has more than just weight of the bike to think about. Rotational mass makes a difference in the feel of the bike as well as actual weight. So yeah, a 450 could kick your @$$, where a 250 would be feather light in comparison, even IF the bike only weighs 20# more.
But...but...but...wheelies! :lol:

Maintenance isn't an issue for me, a KDX and WR would be the same as I only do the small stuff myself ;-). I love the KDX, the thing is that I often go on short Sunday rides (50-150km), but most of my enduro rides are 200km one way (sleeping for one night or two, then heading back another way). In these long distance instances, I find the KDX a bit of a pain in the ass. I need to dump the transmission oil once I get to destination (not really a problem) and carry a lot of 2T oil (I once ran out of oil in a massive miscalculation). Not to mention the gas guzzling effect... A 4T just makes more sense for a lot of stuff in my area.
royadams wrote:My brother has a 12 wr250f I've ridden it several times. It's a nice bike but I prefer his 10 yz250f over it. My friend had a wr450 . It was nice on the fast stuff but could be a real handful when it got tight. He went from the 450 to the new 250 fx . He said he would not go back to the 450. As far as my preference, In a hare scramble I would pick my brothers yz250f with the 290 big bore kit. It's real easy to ride fast. In single track I prefer my kdx 250/ kx 125 hybrid. I'm thinking about getting a yzf for my race bike and just ride my hybrid when we head to the technical stuff.
Thanks for the input.
osobad wrote:I raced a wr250f for a couple of years. I loved that bike . I had a lot of work done to it. 290kit , yz intake cam externinal oil res removed and so on. Faster in woods and easier to ride for long periods than 450 for most. e button helps if you stal in some places
External oil reservoir? Like overflow from radiators? That's one thing that attracts me to the 250. Given that many here have some km on them, I like the idea of being able to put a 270-290 kit on it once it needs a new piston/topend. Most reviews seem to be good (except that some say it vibrates more at high speed). How did the 250f compare to a KDX?
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WR450F/WR250F

Post by osobad »

it is a tank that sits under engine . We remove it to save weight . Basically makes it like yz. Susposed to make it oil the internals better . Factory riders did this also. I hade over 200 hrs on motor and everything was in spec including valves. Used shell rotella t changed every 3hrs
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by Bitteeinit »

royadams wrote:My brother has a 12 wr250f I've ridden it several times. It's a nice bike but I prefer his 10 yz250f over it. My friend had a wr450 . It was nice on the fast stuff but could be a real handful when it got tight. He went from the 450 to the new 250 fx . He said he would not go back to the 450. As far as my preference, In a hare scramble I would pick my brothers yz250f with the 290 big bore kit. It's real easy to ride fast. In single track I prefer my kdx 250/ kx 125 hybrid. I'm thinking about getting a yzf for my race bike and just ride my hybrid when we head to the technical stuff.
Well, I just found a fairly nice (only 3 rides since imported) 03 YZ250F for a good price (like 1.5-2k les than most fresh WR imports)... Does your brother use it as his main woods bike? Was it a real pain in the woods given lack of E-starter and more high strung engine? Has his YZ been reliable? It seems like most parts are interchangeable (except maybe cams and pistons?). Lights are needed, but the days of big kits are gone as one can find cheap 50-100$ LED kits on Amazon. Only issue is perhaps making it more forgiving for really tight 1st gear stuff (which I seldom do) by switching the flywheel?
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WR450F/WR250F

Post by osobad »

earlier wr and yz could be tempermental starting,but changing intake cam fixed that issue. also had higher seat hieght
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by royadams »

Yes we only ride woods. His has a recluse auto clutch and the suspension revalved for woods. I have not ridden the older steel framed bike, so not sure on how they ride. 08 and up had the sss forks everyone loves.his has a 290 kit and is fairly high strung. But the 4 strokes get such good traction it does not get wild on you. I personally like the power delivery going from my 2 stoke to it.
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by Bitteeinit »

For those interested (future searches), I test rode a WR250F yesterday. I have to say I'm impressed. Here are my impressions"
1-First thing I noticed was the tight handling: WAYYYY better than the KDX. One of my only gripes with the KDX are the steep fork angles and big turning radius. I find myself making 5-point turns when trying to turn around or navigate a really tight turn on the trail. You could do much smaller circles or figure 8s with this bike. One thing which I'm not used to about 4ts off-road anymore after the KDX is the way it "stayed the course". The KDX will bounce and I can choose lines and the rear skids, but this felt like a mini tank that would just go whereever I point hte front wheel. Felt both good and bad at the same time, just a matter of getting used to it.
2-Took me a while to figure it out, but now I know why they say this bike likes to scream/wound up. I felt decent torque but not much happening until I finally twisted the throttle all the way then...BAM! This little thing flies! Keep in mind I was going up and down sidewalk curbs in 1st or 2nd, and going full out in second (and almost in third) in city streets, so I couldn't really trail test it full out. Bu tI have to say it almost felt like a 2-stroke with the hit... Kind of scared me the first time (mostly because the throttle was badly adjusted and was kind of jolty).

So I figure this could be an ideal bike for these parts. Fairly good

However, I won't be getting that one. The owner had had it for months and only ridden it 3 times or so (which I believe). He'd bought it off a friend. However, you could tell he knew nothing about bikes and was just running it to the ground (in typical Cambodian fashion). The air filter was bone dry and fraying/disintegrating everywhere. The rear chain guard/guide was bent, rear brake fluid cap had a crack in it, plastic tank had been "welded", plastics covered up with sheets of plastic... Only good thing was clean oil (I assume he just changed it before posting it up for sale). The bike had works skidplate, was 03, seems like the PO in the states had done at least the AIS removal kit mod.... The bike ran strong (though I don't have another reference point) and lifted up a tad off the ground in second if I positioned myself well. Still, I told myself I wouldn't buy a beat up bike again, who knows what the piston is like... A 290 kit would easily solve that, but it would be nice to ride it without worry for at least a little while. Now I need to try a 450f... Honestly, I think the 250f will be plenty for my type of riding. I suspect it'll go quite fast even in the long straights and still have decent fuel economy.

The bike was up for sale at $2700, and he went down to 2600 and as I was leaving asked if I'd buy it for 2500... Still not worth it, but part of me wants to call him up in a week and offer 2200 or something. Probably not a good idea though... But clean imports here are 4500! Christ... Saw a nice/CLEAN 01' KDX for 2200 though...Hmmmm...
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by Julien D »

It is exceedingly difficult to find a 10+ y/o 250 thumper that I would be comfortable purchasing. So many things to go wrong compared to an older 2t. Good luck on your search!
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by Bitteeinit »

I'm not sure that's true. Well actually, more moving parts so I suppose you're right. However, there's no way to replace a 2 stroke cylinder here, so a cheap, lower quality sleeve is the only way to go. Also, I have to order and import all the major parts for a top end. Luckily, that's not much compared to a 4 stroke, but when something small breaks, I have to order... Luckily, stuff like fork seals, brake pads and so on are all readily available. But engine and transmission parts? No way. Meanlwhile, parts for thumpers are all over, so there are tons of xr250s from like the early 90s which are still being ridden.

I usually always ride alone, but went out a day ride yesterday with 3 other guys. First fuel stop when we arrived at destination: I put in 6l, they each put in 3l (two Wr250fs and an old XR250r). We rode around a mountain nearby, then had a lunch break. We then joined a bunch of other riders who were in the area (2 or 3 of which were really strong) so we were a total of 12... 3 KDXs including mine! All 95+ though. Just when we joined them, I added another 2l (they added nothing). On my way back, I put in another 4l...

I hate to sound like a cheapo, but fuel economy and range are also a reason I'm looking for something else. It was a big riding day (154km according to my gps), but still... They can get away with 6-8l during a day of hard riding, whereas it costs me 12l+the 2 stroke oil. I do think it's something to consider. That being said, it was fun to ride and the bike performed flawlessly (kicking it has been a problem, but I finally found a source for cheap Honda 10w30 oil and it works well). For some reason, my gopro fucked up and I didn't get any videos, but we went through some awesome trails.
Here are a few pictures from some stops:
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Guy on a 250 KTM got a flat tire so we moved to a road and fixed it:
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3 KDXs, one wr450f, one ktm 250, one xr250 and the rest were all wr250s.

I got to try a PRISTINE 2005 wr450f (3700$) a few days ago, and while it handled much easier than I imagined (easy to make it crawl/stay stable, power delivery was very predictable with no big surprises), it's a hog compared to the 250s or a KDX. Not sure if it's for me.

The three original riders I was with were luckily all the same skill level as me. One was perhaps a bit weaker than the rest of us, but not by much. I was probably the most skilled in very slow technical stuff (climbs). However, once we joined those other 8 guys, things got intense. They were all quite strong, and rode FAST, especially through very sandy trails and I'm not a strong sand rider. Good practice I guess, and they knew all the trails which was nice. I usually have to constantly check the map if I'm alone. Riding in full out 3rd in sandy trails definitely put me and that other guy out of our comfort zones, but I suppose that's how you become a better/faster rider. I have to say I hated all the dust from riding with others because of the visibility (and my lungs). Humbling to be past by repeatedly a guy on an old xr. 90% rider, 10% bike as the saying goes... Maybe just a CLEAN 95+ kdx is the ticket. Then again, I'm also wondering if I should buy a Transalp for touring, so I guess I need to a bit of soul searching, haha.

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WR450F/WR250F

Post by osobad »

speed is your friend in sand. That's what we have here in florida.
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by Julien D »

Just to point out, you can't compare an xr250 to a modern 250f. Totally different beasts. The xr250 will run forever. Any 250f is going to require pretty regular maintenance. Although as far as I know, the WR is the way to go for longevity on the trails. I can understand your issues with parts availability, but I would much rather have a 2 stroke cylinder sleeved than have to shell out for a replacement 250f cylinder and head. Just my 2 cents, and take that with a grain of salt, as I am certainly somewhat biased. :wink:
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by kawabunga »

To the OP: Set the sag on the rear spring. You'll be amazed how it can change your steering.
The previous owner of my bike had the rear set full-low for seat height issue. Bike turned like a submarine. By playing around with suspension you can get that KDX to turn like a bat-chasing-bugs.
reviving old war-horse.
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Re: WR450F/WR250F

Post by gsa102 »

I had an 07 wr 450, and tried to race it. My KDX was easier to ride on difficult terrain. The 450 does wear you out in the tight stuff. Loads of power that most people can't use, and I was always on the brakes, the suspension is not as good as the YZ model. Not a fan of the WR250F, as the motor development lagged way behind the other 250Fs.

I reccommend the CRF250X. The CRF250X is an under-appreciated model (like the KDX) with electric start and really good suspension. Easy to hop up with just a CRF250R cam. I would get one myself if I found a deal on one, but would have to sell the KDX or buy a diamond ring.

Two rules for a 4t: keep the air filter clean, change the oil often. They will last a very long time if you do both. A lot of people don't.
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